Pay him, in 2 years he'll be the 5th or 6th highest paid CB. This team needs to fully realize that overpaying is something crap organizations have to do to retain or gain talent.
Valid point, and that is true, just like any other position once an elite player gets paid he's the highest paid until the next one gets paid. My hesitation is that stud CBs have been known to start to fall of the cliff pretty quickly once they hit age 30 and Slay has already shown signs of a decline. If they could get a 2nd rounder for him I would take it.
Post by badnews3123 on Feb 20, 2020 9:32:55 GMT -6
Have they shown that they break down at 30? Sherman, Hayward, Peterson, Haden, Harris are all guys 30+ still playing at a high level.
And I’m not sure Slay has really slipped. He’s being asked to do something that maybe 1 or 2 other guys in the league do, if that. All the while having one of the leagues worst pass rushes and OC’s scheming routes that are extremely difficult to cover with no pass rush.
If they can’t come to a deal, then it is what it is, but I’d hesitate on trading him. Especially given what they ask of him, it’s not easily replaceable. Onky positive is I think Okudah is that kind of guy, but it will take time and obviously other factors involved there.
Post by italianstallion on Feb 20, 2020 10:44:50 GMT -6
the Lions are gonna be trash in 2020
take the best offer and run regarding slay - which will probably be a low 2 ( or a 3 and A 6 OR A 3 AND A Player )
I don't even feel their is a real need to even sign anybody major in 2020, this team is gonna suck and save all that money for free agency in 2021.
Until Stafford is gone, cannot truly start a rebuild so this team is in " STUCK MODE "
as I said in the Stafford post, everybody is tradeable I feel besides Ragnow, Hockenson, Golladay, flowers ( only cuz of his contract), and Prater.
I have no problems with us tanking and trading everybody like the Dolphins did in 2019 if its gonna lead to a more effective rebuild for the 2021 season.
Trade Slay , Trade Stafford ( after the guaranteed money its really only an 11 million dead money , cuz 13 getting spent regardless unless they work that out with the team that he'd be getting traded to and redid the contract), Cut Kennard ( save 5.5 Million ) - that's 42.5 million , and let Glasgow walk .
Have they shown that they break down at 30? Sherman, Hayward, Peterson, Haden, Harris are all guys 30+ still playing at a high level.
Eh, I would say all of those guys have shown signs of decline. I know Sherman had sort of a comeback season but he was showing signs of decline prior to 2019. I'm guessing his 2019 season will turn out to be an anomaly. And by the way Peterson was 29 last season.
Perhaps a better way to word it is most stud CB show obvious signs of decline by 30 and tend to fall off the cliff around 31-32.
Have they shown that they break down at 30? Sherman, Hayward, Peterson, Haden, Harris are all guys 30+ still playing at a high level.
Eh, I would say all of those guys have shown signs of decline. I know Sherman had sort of a comeback season but he was showing signs of decline prior to 2019. I'm guessing his 2019 season will turn out to be an anomaly. And by the way Peterson was 29 last season.
Perhaps a better way to word it is most stud CB show obvious signs of decline by 30 and tend to fall off the cliff around 31-32.
Those are just a few guys off the top of my head. I’d question how much those guys have declined, too.
Honestly outside of QB, pretty much every positions starts to fall off a cliff at 32. And the thing is Slay just turned 29. If he wants some 5-6 year extension, then I’d say for sure look to move him. I doubt that’s the case though and it would like be a 3-4 year extension which would mean there would be a clean after year 2 or 3, when Slay would 31-32.
Honestly outside of QB, pretty much every positions starts to fall off a cliff at 32.
Agree. It just seems to me that CBs tend to fall quicker (thinking of guys like Revis, Asomugha, Norman). But I suppose for everyone of those guys there is also a Champ Bailey that plays at a high level into his 30's. But I don't think Slay is close to Champ Bailey level.
And the thing is Slay just turned 29. If he wants some 5-6 year extension, then I’d say for sure look to move him. I doubt that’s the case though and it would like be a 3-4 year extension which would mean there would be a clean after year 2 or 3, when Slay would 31-32.
Yeah, I wouldn't have a problem with that and if you think this team is really that close to contending it makes sense. But I don't see this team going anywhere anytime soon so if they can get a high pick for him I say do it.
Agree. It just seems to me that CBs tend to fall quicker (thinking of guys like Revis, Asomugha, Norman). But I suppose for everyone of those guys there is also a Champ Bailey that plays at a high level into his 30's. But I don't think Slay is close to Champ Bailey level.
Slay isn't Champ, but that's not really an insult. Champ is probably one of the 10 best CB's to ever play. But really that doesn't have anything to do with it. Champ played at a fairly high level longer than even the guys I listed, but who knows how. Asmougha pretty much shut down the second he got his money from Eagles, I remember there being talk he wasn't that invested in football. Revis was a weird one, the lights just shut off all of a sudden. I never thought Norman was that good to begin with and was completely scheme specific.
Yeah, I wouldn't have a problem with that and if you think this team is really that close to contending it makes sense. But I don't see this team going anywhere anytime soon so if they can get a high pick for him I say do it.
Reality is the way they are set up now might as well push all the chips in. They're not blowing it up this season and even if they do next season, Slay will still be a tradeable asset and they have plenty of moves to make that could create cap space.
Post by italianstallion on Feb 21, 2020 10:32:23 GMT -6
Only reason to even try to push your chips in is to save bobs and matts and matts job. Not smart to go all in on 2020. this team has 53 million in cap space now and is still nowhere close to contending and surely won't be even after if they did. better off sucking and having more picks and even more cap space for 2021 and getting this rebuilding project going.
I like what the 49ers did and I can see the logic in what the dolphins did and we should be doing the same with trading everybody or cutting and shedding cap space. Set youtself up for long term success rather than short sell for 2020.
Post by Blaming Brad on Mar 3, 2020 16:29:05 GMT -6
Slay's price tag probably just went down with Bouye only commanding a 4th. Slay is probably slightly better but Bouye is younger and has 2 years left on his deal.
Post by badnews3123 on Mar 3, 2020 19:13:12 GMT -6
Slay is better than Bouye and there’s all of 8 months between them in age, that’s not a factor for anyone but you BB, but that’s a low price. To me if you can’t get a top 50 pick, it’s not worth it.
Last Edit: Mar 3, 2020 19:15:50 GMT -6 by badnews3123
Slay's price tag probably just went down with Bouye only commanding a 4th. Slay is probably slightly better but Bouye is younger and has 2 years left on his deal.
I would think the shorter contract would make him more valuable. But I also don't think Slay gets traded without a sign and trade type of deal.
I would think the shorter contract would make him more valuable.
How so? All things being equal, wouldn't you want the guy locked down for 2 years versus 1?
I think it depends on the contract. I don’t think it makes that much difference in the end because if Slay and Bouye both get traded to teams and both end up being what the team expects them to be. Both are getting new deals, if they’re not. Both will be playing for new teams in 2021.
I think it depends on the contract. I don’t think it makes that much difference in the end because if Slay and Bouye both get traded to teams and both end up being what the team expects them to be. Both are getting new deals,
But Bouye's gives you more flexibility. Unlike Bouye, a Slay trade would likely be dependent on getting a deal done with the new team which will make it harder to trade him, thus bringing his value down. I'm just talking strictly from a trade value perspective. And I agree with you that anything less than a top 50 pick isn't worth it. And based on the Bouye trade I think it's safe to say they are not getting a top 50 pick.
Post by badnews3123 on Mar 4, 2020 10:58:38 GMT -6
Bouye will want a new deal and likely hold out if he doesn’t get one. I don’t think the situations are that different. You may have him under contract for an extra year on paper, but reality is the situation isn’t that different.
And I don’t think they’ll end up getting a top 50 pick, but I think around the league Slay is more highly regarded than Lions fans may think. What Patricia has asked him to do here, very few if any other CB’s in the league are doing.
Trade Slay while we can get something for him because I guarantee you he will get burned bad this season. Every DC seen his decline and will be targeting him. Let someone else overpay him.
Slay traded for 3rd and 5th in 2020. Lions save about $10 mil on the cap this year. About $3 mil in dead money.
Talk about getting hosed. Quinn and Patricia got ripped. One of the best CB's in the league for basically nothing more than a role player for a season or two. 3rd rounders can be good, but 5throunders? At least get a second!!!
WE G O T
H O S E D
Of course Slay didn't help. We should have kept him. F em. No wonder this team sucks year in and year out. No killer instinct in the FO either.
That is a rather meager haul...Hopefully the draft picks can be used wisely..either in the draft or as bargain chips to trade up...But all in all a necessary move as Slay was obviously a disgruntled player who wanted to go to a place where he could get to the playoffs. Maybe we can sign Jadeveon Clowney or Melvin Gordon now with the cap space. It also freed up some cap for some future moves. Lets face it, this team needs some "bold" changes to get to the next level. So I liked Slay as a Player and a person. Good Luck to him. Maybe his departure will bring us the next Champ Bailey.